by Ubertino Eco
“…It’s hard to accept the idea that there cannot be an order in the universe because it would offend the free will of God and His omnipotence. So the freedom of God is our condemnation, or at least the condemnation of our pride.”
"I dared, for the first and last time in my life, to exprss a theological conclusion: “But how can a necessary being exist totally polluted with the possible? What difference is there, then, between God and primigenial chaos? Isn’t affirming God’s absolute omnipotence and His absolute freedom with regard to His own choices tantamount to demonstrating that God does not exist?”
William looked at me without betraying any feeling in his features, and he said, “ how could a learned man go on communicating his learning if he answered yes to your questions?” I did not understand the meaning of his words. “Do you mean,” I asked, “that there would be no possible and communicable learning any more if the very criterion of truth were lacking, or do you mean you could no longer communicate what you know because other would not allow you to?” -------pp, 493
or what does Eco really think. of God. ;-)
From what had happened, Adso came to the daring conclusion that "God does not exist" . And William's answer was an evasive "yes".
However, one has to remember "what had happened", or this story, was entired and very carefully constructed by Eco. To me, this conversation explained why the story had proceeded as it was: a seemingly mystery ended up suddenly in smoke.
Which is to say that Eco has made up a compelling story to illustrate his VIEW that God does not exist (whether God exists or not is a different matter).
My more complete review is here.
That's all, folks. :-)
8 comments:
There's a possibility here the author could be addressing the confusion religious people, even the kind who make a career out of religion, may have at some point of their lives. Don't you find it's unfathomable how they hold down to their belief in something from which they never get any feedback? I imagine they get confused and doubtful sometimes when they're frustrated with understanding the world.
Prior to the passages you quoted, William acknowledged that he did see all the signs but didn't understand the relation among them. It's because he was seeking ONE single story that could chain all these signs together. The truth was there were several stories underlying all the crimes, which all seemed to be connected with one another. Once he couldn't find that SINGLE story, he declared that "there is no order in the universe". This reflected his "intellectual vanity", which Adso later said he was praying that God could forgive him for that.
I guess the message could be the world appears to be chaotic, but there's still an order underneath that. This order can be beyond our understanding, which is our limitation as human, which is the manifestation of God's existence.
It's just my interpretation. :-)
>>>Don't you find it's unfathomable how they hold down to their belief in something from which they never get any feedback?
it is my belief that people do everything for a reason, rational in their own minds (but not necessarily rational in others' eyes). of course truly religious people get "feedbacks" for their belief, just as musicians get crazy for a classical masterpiece - i can say this because i can't enjoy either. ironic? ;-)
>>>I imagine they get confused and doubtful sometimes when they're frustrated with understanding the world.
true but where the author places and how he depicts this kind of moments reveals his own understanding of such issues. :-)
>>>It's because he was seeking ONE single story that could chain all these signs together. The truth was there were several stories underlying all the crimes, which all seemed to be connected with one another. Once he couldn't find that SINGLE story, he declared that "there is no order in the universe". This reflected his "intellectual vanity", which Adso later said he was praying that God could forgive him for that.
because if there had been a GOD, there should have been a SINGLE story.
>>>I guess the message could be the world appears to be chaotic, but there's still an order underneath that. This order can be beyond our understanding, which is our limitation as human, which is the manifestation of God's existence.
aha! except all stories (chaos) in this book could be explained rationally and easily without the need of a GOD, which was what "frustrated": there was really no mistery/miracle/power above logic - that was the message. to me anyway.
It is always fun for me to discuss this kind of stuff in detail or in general. we don't need to agree; it's enlightening to just exchange and share. thanks, vera!
>>>Also, my mentality was I was supposed to read a straight forward detective story. :O)
yushi, don't give up, just yet. the first feedback the author got after finishing the book was cutting off the 1st 100 or so pages. it will get into a straight forward detective story soon, believe me. more or less anyway. and it will be fun. ;-)
but i also want to check his other works, too. so thanks for the recommendation. :-)
Yushi seems to be kedou, right? Luguo is right - after 100 pages, it'll go much faster. In fact, even if you skipped the next 40 pages, no loss. (isn't the same as "Crime and punishment"? I remember the first 100 pages seemed to be there just to test your endurance. :-))
Thanks for the recommendation. I just checked out "The history of beauty". A fine one indeed.
> It is always fun for me to discuss this kind of stuff in detail or in general. we don't need to agree; it's enlightening to just exchange and share.
Ditto. :-)
yes, yushi is kedou. ;-)
yushi,
nice comments and quotes! it is no good this interesting discussion by you and vera is hidden here. should i copy it to cnd?
Hi Luguo and Kedou,I hadn't been here since summer.
Interesting comments, Kedou!
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